I want to see this Speech

I doubt Hillary or obama will give this speech..But maybe Mc Cain will.
Sorry..was getting too gushie in here.Orlee even took hootie off the list
again..your so nice..Giggles..and points at ruth..she did it..


WOULDN'T IT BE GREAT TO TURN ON THE TV AND HEAR ANY U.S. PRESIDENT, DEMOCRAT OR
REPUBLICAN GIVE THE FOLLOWING SPEECH?
'My Fellow Americans: As you all know, the defeat of the Iraq regime has been
completed.

Since congress does not want to spend any more money on this war, our mission in
Iraq is complete.

This morning I gave the order for a complete removal of all American forces from
Iraq This action will be complete within 30 days. It is now time to begin the
reckoning.


Before me, I have two lists. One list contains the names of countries which have
stood by our side during the Iraq conflict. This list is short . The United
Kingdom , Spain , Bulgaria , Australia , and Poland are some of the countries
listed there.

The other list contains every one not on the first l ist. Most of the world's nations are on that list. My press secretary will be distributing
copies of both lists later this evening.

Let me start by saying that effective immediately, foreign aid to those nations
on List 2 ceases immediately and indefinitely. The money saved during the first
year alone will pretty much pay for the costs of the Iraqi war. THEN EVERY YEAR
THERE AFTER IT'll GO TO OUR SOCIAL SECURITY SYSTEM SO IT WONT GO BROKE IN 20
YEARS.

The American people are no longer going to pour money into third world Hell
holes and watch those government leaders grow fat on corruption.

Need help with a famine ? Wrestling with an epidemic? Call France .

In the future, together with Congress, I will work to redirect this money toward
solving the vexing social problems we still have at home . On that note, a word
to terrorist organizations. Screw with us and we will hunt you down and
eliminate you and all your friends from the face of the earth.

Thirsting for a gutsy country to terrorize? Try France or maybe China .

I am ordering the immediate severing of diplomatic relations with France ,
Germany , and Russia . Thanks for all your help, comrades. We are retiring from
NATO as well. Bonne chance, mezamies.

I have instructed the Mayor of New York City to begin towing the many UN
diplomatic vehicles located in Manhattan with more than two unpaid parking
tickets to sites where those vehicles will be stripped, shredded and crushed. I
don't care about whatever treaty pertains to this. You creeps have tens of
thousands of unpaid tickets. Pay those tickets tomorrow or watch your precious
Benzes, Beamers and limos be turned over to some of the finest chop shops in the
world. I love New York

A special note to our neighbors. Canada is on List 2. Since we are likely to be
seeing a lot more of each other, you folks might want to try not pissing us off
for a change.

Mexico is also on List 2 its president and his entire corrupt government really
need an attitude adjustment. I will have a couple extra thousand tanks and infantry divisions sitting around. Guess where I am going to put 'em? Yep,
border security.

Oh, by the way, the United States is abrogating the NAFTA treaty - starting now.

We are tired of the one-way highway. Immediately, we'll be drilling for oil in
Alaska- which will take care of this country's oil needs for decades to come. If
you're an environmentalist who opposes this decision, I refer you to List 2
above: pick a country and move there.

It is time for America to focus on its own welfare and its own citizens. Some
will accuse us of isolationism. I answer them by saying, 'darn tootin.'

Nearly a century of trying to help folks live a decent life around the world has
only earned us the undying enmity of just about everyone on the planet. It is
time to eliminate hunger in America It is time to eliminate homelessness in
America . To the nations on List 1, a final thought. Thank you guys. We owe you
and we won't forget.

To the nations on List 2, a final thought: You might want to learn to speak Arabic.

God bless America .. Thank you and good night.'

If you can read this, thank a teacher. If you are reading it in English, thank a
soldier.




Have A Great Day

Buddhafractal

Message to Hong Kong

muddy: After careful consideration,I wonder how your girlfriend would feel if Russia was destroying churches and trying to imprison the pope and invade Italy?This happened over a century ago.
muddy: Maybe it was germany
muddy: or how would she feel if America was bombing mosques in Iraq and trying to imprison ismoms..wait..nevermind
muddy: ok..how would she feel about Turkey attacking the Kurds in Northern Iraq?
muddy: can we see a pattern developing here?
muddy: she its attacking sunnis in Iraq
muddy: sheits
muddy: one religian attacking anothers beliefs and wanting to dominate and imprison

Obama and rezko

“By The Beachwood Rezko Affairs Desk

The front page story in The New York Times this week probing the relationship between Barack Obama and Tony Rezko revealed a few new disturbing facts, though the article was short on explanation and analysis - and there is yet more to the story of Illinois’ favorite son and his dark patron.

Let’s take a look.

* * *

“Mr. Obama has portrayed Mr. Rezko as a one-time fund-raiser whom he had occasionally seen socially. But interviews with more than a dozen political and business associates suggest that the two men were closer than the senator has indicated,” the Times reports.

“Mr. Obama turned to Rezko for help at several important junctures. Records show that when Mr. Obama needed cash in the waning days of his losing 2000 Congressional campaign, Mr. Rezko rounded up thousands of dollars from business contacts. In 2003, Mr. Rezko helped Mr. Obama expand his fund-raising for the Senate primary by being host of a dinner in his Mediterranean-style home for 150 people, including some whose names have come up in the influence scandal.

“And when Mr. Obama and his wife, Michelle, bought a [$1.65 million] house in 2005, Mr. Rezko helped smooth the transaction. Even though his finances were deteriorating, Mr. Rezko arranged for his wife to buy an adjacent lot, and she later sold the Obamas a 10-foot-wide strip of land that expanded their yard.

“The land sale occurred after it had been reported that Mr. Rezko was under federal investigation. That awkward fact prompoted Mr. Obama, who has cast himself as largely free from the normal influences of politics, to express regret over what he called his own bad judgment.”

Why did Obama need Rezko’s help?

‘People familiar with the transaction said that the sellers did not want to close until that June 15, and that the sale would go through only if someone bought the adjacent lot from them on the same date,” the Times reports.

Obama needed a favor from Rezko. He needed someone to buy that adjacent lot on the same day so he and Michelle could get that house. Someone he knew, who would let the Obamas expand their property and keep the rest of the lot, which the Obamas tended, vacant. Far from Rezko slyly buying a home next to a rising star, it was Obama who called Rezko and brought him into the deal.

“Rita Rezko paid $625,000 to outbid others for the lot and later sold the Obama’s one-sixth of that land land, for $104,500,” the Times reports.

“After the Chicago Tribune reported the transactions last November, Mr. Obama said he had acted ethically, though it had been a mistake to let Mr. Rezko do anything that could be seen as a favor.

“The disclosure came four days before Michelle Obama was to appear as a special guest at a charity fashion show organized by Mrs. Rezko. Mrs. Obama attended, though others there said it seemed a bit awkward.”

* * *

“When Mr. Obama first fielded questions about Mr. Rezko last fall, he said they had had lunch once or twice a year and had socialized with their wives ‘two to four times.’”

Not so.

“In addition to enlisting his huge circle of donors, Mr. Rezko and Mr. Obama talked frequently about campaign developments during the Senate race, Mr. Rezko’s associates said.”

* * *

“In one instance, when he was running for the Senate, Mr. Obama stopped by to shake hands while Mr. Rezko, an immigrant from Syria, was entertaining Middle Eastern bankers considering an investment in one of his projects.”

* * *

“While Mr. Obama was running for the Senate, Mr. Rezko was also raising money for a huge development in the South Loop of Chicago, often playing host to dinners in a private room at the Four Seasons Hotel here.

“Former Rezko associates said that Governor Blagojevich attended one of the dinners, and that at Mr. Rezko’s request, Mr. Obama dropped in at one for Middle Eastern bankers in early 2004, just as he was starting to pull ahead in the Senate primary. The visits, Mr. Rezko’s partners said, helped impress foreign guests.

“‘I remember that he had been on the campaign trail, and he was completely wiped out and exhausted,’ said Anthony Licata, a lawyer who represented Mr. Rezko on real estate deals. ‘My recollection is that he drank ice tea, and he talked about how he was really making progress, and we were all excited to see him.’

* * *

Obama refused to talk to the Times for the story. His campaign office issued a content-free written statement. Obama has previously said he never did Rezko a favor. And, of course, he often says that his a different kind of campaign - a movement - for those who think politics is an insider’s game. But at every step of the way, Obama has played that game with utmost expediency. Far from carving out a niche as an independent reformer with clean hands, he has embraced the worst elements of the Machine - Rezko, Daley, Jones, Stroger, Tillman - to advance his own ambition. And I can tell you, Obama fans, that we haven’t heard it all yet. Particularly where Rezko is concerned.”

Something to ponder

Here is a passage I found to be a great response to the question, What was he thinking? that the ’shocked’ people asked when they heard rev wright’s “sermon”.

Over the weekend members of our church and others have been subjected to the relentless airing of two or three brief video clips of sermons by the Rev. Dr. Jeremiah A. Wright, Jr., pastor of Trinity United Church of Christ for thirty-six years and, for over half of those years, pastor of Senator Barack Obama and his family. These video clips, and news stories about them, have been served up with frenzied and heated commentary by media personalities expressing shock that such language and sentiments could be uttered from the pulpit.

One is tempted to ask whether these commentators ever listen to the overcharged rhetoric of their own opinion shows. Even more to the point is to wonder whether they have a working knowledge of the history of preaching in the United States from the unrelentingly grim language of New England election day sermons to the fiery rhetoric of the Black church prophetic tradition. Maybe they prefer the false prophets with their happy homilies in Jeremiah who say to the people: “You shall not see the sword, nor shall you have famine, but I will give you true peace in this place.” To which God responds, “The prophets are prophesying lies in my name; I did not send them, nor did I command them or speak to them. They are prophesying to you a lying vision, worthless divination, and the deceit of their own minds. . . . By sword and famine those prophets shall be consumed,” (Jeremiah 14.14-15). The Biblical Jeremiah was coarse and provocative. Faithfulness, not respectability was the order of the day then. And now?

What’s really going on here? First, it may state the obvious to point out that these television and radio shows have very little interest in Trinity Church or Jeremiah Wright. Those who sifted through hours of sermons searching for a few lurid phrases and those who have aired them repeatedly have only one intention. It is to wound a presidential candidate. In the process a congregation that does exceptional ministry and a pastor who has given his life to shape those ministries is caricatured and demonized. You don’t have to be an Obama supporter to be alarmed at this. Will Clinton’s United Methodist Church be next? Or McCain’s Episcopal Church? Wouldn’t we have been just as alarmed had it been Huckabee’s Southern Baptist Church, or Romney’s Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints?

Many of us would prefer to avoid the stark and startling language Pastor Wright used in these clips. But what was his real crime? He is condemned for using a mild “obscenity” in reference to the United States. This week we mark the fifth anniversary of the war in Iraq, a war conceived in deception and prosecuted in foolish arrogance. Nearly four thousand cherished Americans have been killed, countless more wounded, and tens of thousands of Iraqis slaughtered. Where is the real obscenity here? True patriotism requires a degree of self-criticism, even self-judgment that may not always be easy or genteel. Pastor Wright’s judgment may be starker and more sweeping than many of us are prepared to accept. But is the soul of our nation served any better by the polite prayers and gentle admonitions that have gone without a real hearing for these five years while the dying and destruction continues?

We might like to think that racism is a thing of the past, that Martin Luther King’s harmonious multi-racial vision, articulated in his speech at the Lincoln Memorial in 1963 and then struck down by an assassin’s bullet in Memphis in 1968, has somehow been resurrected and now reigns throughout the land. Significant progress has been made. A black man is a legitimate candidate for President of the United States. A black woman serves as Secretary of State. The accomplishments are profound. But on the gritty streets of Chicago’s south side where Trinity has planted itself, race continues to play favorites in failing urban school systems, unresponsive health care systems, crumbling infrastructure, and meager economic development. Are we to pretend all is well because much is, in fact, better than it used to be? Is it racist to name the racial divides that continue to afflict our nation, and to do so loudly? How ironic that a pastor and congregation which, for forty-five years, has cast its lot with a predominantly white denomination, participating fully in its wider church life and contributing generously to it, would be accused of racial exclusion and a failure to reach for racial reconciliation.

The gospel narrative of Palm Sunday’s entrance into Jerusalem concludes with the overturning of the money changers’ tables in the Temple courtyard. Here wealth and power and greed were challenged for the way the poor were oppressed to the point of exclusion from a share in the religious practices of the Temple. Today we watch as the gap between the obscenely wealthy and the obscenely poor widens. More and more of our neighbors are relegated to minimal health care or to no health care at all. Foreclosures destroy families while unscrupulous lenders seek bailouts from regulators who turned a blind eye to the impending crisis. Should the preacher today respond to this with only a whisper and a sigh?

Is Pastor Wright to be ridiculed and condemned for refusing to play the court prophet, blessing land and sovereign while pledging allegiance to our preoccupation with wealth and our fascination with weapons? In the United Church of Christ we honor diversity. For nearly four centuries we have respected dissent and have struggled to maintain the freedom of the pulpit. Not every pastor in the United Church of Christ will want to share Pastor Wright’s rhetoric or his politics. Not every member will rise to shout “Amen!” But I trust we will all struggle in our own way to resist the lure of respectable religion that seeks to displace evangelical faith. For what this nation needs is not so much polite piety as the rough and radical word of the prophet calling us to repentance. And, as we struggle with that ancient calling, I pray we will be shrewd enough to name the hypocrisy of those who decry the mixing of religion and politics in order to serve their own political ends.

The Rev. John H. Thomas speaking at Trinity UCC on March 2, 2008

We Have the Same Problem

It appears we do have the same problem we have had since 1976..Both partys have
done nothing to change our consumpsion habits except tax the shit out of
us..Which you are in favor of more I seem to recall,as long as obama or hillary
suggests them!
Study up your global economics and you will see that china,and Russia,and
India,are all competing for the black gold now,this is what is driving prices up
globally.That and the instability over in the middle east region.Hang onto your
ass orlee,cause its goin up to 5 bucks a gallon..No shit..So the sooner we lock
in air fare to vegas the better..I say less blame,more solutions are called
for..Shit,lets invade Iran,that should drive the prices down..lol..I love Dick
Cheney  Mudd out

oil prices

By Orlee;
it appears we have a huge problem again.. seems like going to the gas pumps is like going to the bank and just saying put me a account at the pumps.. today our prices here in ohio and the arounding states is $3.45 .. i know for a fact new york and pennsylvania are of the same priceing with $3.29 being a bargin.. i was in new york last night..
when george bush became president the price of a barrel of oil was $39 dollars a gallon.. when asked what he thought of the prices going to be as high as $5.00 a gallon by summer he said.. "who told you that" the new man then said it is common knowledge. his response was .. "I didnt know that" .. of course he didnt know that .. when the hell has he filled a car at a gas pump lately.. but he should of known since his daddy has a permanent smile from all the profits his family is makeing..

myself i look at it as to how much more it takes me to get from one place to the next.. doesnt seem like alot of money when you look at it and say .. well its going to take me 50 cent or so more .. to go from point a to point b. but when you look at the other cost which will be going up .. like food because of delivery costs and every other service we get delivered .. air line tickets and so. on i could go on forever..

one more lovely thought.. once they get us to pay these prices. there wont be any drops .. you can bet on that when like the tax cuts we supposibly have had we actually got a break in anything.. ...

they dont hate us

Orlee,I have to congratulate you and the rest of the older ohio women voters who
came out and rescued Hillary from an early retirement from the contest.I dont
know how she did it .(Im still smellin something fishy in those contests by the
way)The way the youth came out to vote it's still makin me scratch my head in
bewilderment.as to how she stole the vote..Probably the same way Bush stole
Florida,huh?lol...So now it will come down to superdelegates,and again,I think
with the way the election is being followed this time globally,Your party is
about to have a pretty tough convention.You better order extra hookers for the
delegates..Cause its gonna be like south korea's parliment swinging on each
other and trying to land kicks and head butts.You and Willy have it right
though,it aint over till november..I didnt vote in my primary eather,so things
could look real different by the time the main election comes around.I'm still
pissed and boycotting washington state elections cause of th
e gov race that was stolen by a democrat after a republican won the vote and the recounts,but on the 3rd
recount bullshit prevailed and they declared the other person the winner all of
a sudden..Horseshit back door politics I call it.
 Also,My grandfather was a life member out of the painters union,and received a
union pension after he retired till he died..It wasnt much,but it was
something..And it did him good..But today my same painters union has sold my job
to illeagle mexicans and rotates 600 mexicans around for 200 jobs,in order that
nobody gets enough hours for benifits,and they get triple dues,and eliminated
vacation pay,and charge you twice for dues checkoff fee.I'm sorry,but this is
not the same union my grandfather helped build..In fact,his son,my uncle,quit
the union after 17 years service in disguest,along with his son my cousin.  Both
are ultra craftsmen,like none left today in the unions.In california,they asked
my dad why he didnt go out to the jobsites anymore to see how the product was
performing(mudd) He would calmly tell them " I dont speak spanish!"Oh,and last year I bought my first non

american car,my saab..but it was already here,and the sweeds are ok,they dont

hate us..Mudd out.

Willy's going Goofy

 From Orlee
muddy if you and I were to be confidential advisors to the governement.. i would
> guess this country would be way different.. the reality of it is that we cant
> run the governement and we can hopefully get by with what is handed to us.. i
> have no problem with older people running our governement.. but i do think
with
> like every job in the united states at some point a, few really need to
retire..
> 
> look at some of the men like kennedy.. he can hardly walk and he expects
> everyone to think he can live forever and do what he does.. i respect the man
> but there is alot of good men out there who should be able to try . some of
our
> very brightest is learning from the world how to handle it.. i would hope that
> the younger generation would take part and build this country to the best it
was
> and can be again.. look at the supreme court someone looks like they have to
die
> before a new judge is appointed..
> cheney for instance has a bad heart.. i think if your health is in question..
> its time to go.. i am sure they have enough money to get by..
> 
> but if you look at the young now.. they live for the moment.. they try to plan
> for their own futures in a very different way than our fathers did..
> 
> i know you do not agree on unions.. but trust and believe it was men from
early
> on who took the notion that to band together as one and fight for the right of
> all that made this country a much better place.. it put forth the bargining
> commitees to help families and to make sure the workers got their fair share.
> 
> if you take the workers of the usa out of the formula.. because of prices then
> your taking the money out of the programs set up for our families.. in the
> 1970's way before anyone suggested we send our work outside the country..
willy
> and i took care into always trying to buy made in america products.. its not
> easy to do that now.. look on any clothing shelf or product label you wont
find
> too many union labels.. thats sad.. so what our products cost us a slight
higher
> price.. we had plenty of jobs and plenty of products to buy before we decided.
> to move thing out our country..
> they try to tell us that since we get things brought in were getting them
priced
> cheaper.. i sure cant find anything cheaper to buy at a store..
> 
> the everyday products we all use are way over priced..
> 
> so getting jobs back is a very big deal to me..
> 
> i guess i am rambling again.. but heres a funny thing happened to me and
willy..
> 
> 
>
>  muddy here i sit.. willy is going goofy on me.. yesterday after the vote i
> asked him who he voted for .. his answer was.. its a private ballot.. i aint
> telling.. lol.. ya know what that means to me.. the battle is on.. for someone
> to say i love you we can conquer the world.. and then say .. i am not telling
> you who i voted for.. well.. the game is on.. ..
>
> now he has tried to tell me like 40 times who he voted for and each time i
say..
> no no no.. i cant believe you now lol.. its driving him nuts.. when this all
> happened i told him he would be so proud to tell me the truth and tell me who
he
> voted for.. he says.. he voted for neither candidate.. that he wanted to just
> wait and see who would win.. his one lil vote wouldnt make a big difference..
he
> is actually very right.. had i thought of that i myself would of made that
> choice.. so i am unsure why he decided to not tell me this before we went to
> vote..
> 
> 
> oh by the way .. he will put a mark on the presidential vote .. 

Vote for Ralph Nader

I was proud of mike huckabee as he bowed out of the race.I was equally repulsed
by the McCain acceptance speech.What a cardboard cut out of a real person.All he
did was read poorly written cue cards and babble nonsense about you,and me,and
the end of useless govt spending and bla bla bla..The look in his eye told me he
was gettin some from his wifey as soon as he left the stage,probably missionary
position.I respectfully reserve my vote for president choice untill after the
democratic convention and who is running on their side..Shit,I might have to
vote for Ralph Nader,and I hate that fuckwad for outlawing the best car I ever
had (63 corvair)Wait,hes even older than McCain,nevermind.  

Ohio is done

 from orlee
> > after yestedays vote seems like ohio is done for the moment.. although the
> momentum here was good.. hillary is the winner from us in case some didnt
know..
> not sure how her delegates stack up at the moment but from all indications ..
> obama is still in the lead with delegates.. i am unsure which states still
have
> to vote.. muddy have you voted yet.. i was sorry to see your candidate
huckabee
> leave the running actually..whats that  mean in terms of your vote.. do you
> think you will sway to the democrat side? good question huh? or will you
remain
> a republican..
> 
> i have been watching mc cain close now.. to me he doesnt even seem to have
> anything of a good campain yet. maybe now that he is the only runner on the
> republican side. we will hear something about what his party stands for.. but
at
> the moment. i think hillary and obama will take the forefront on all news
> channels.. its going to be interesting to say the least.. 

Make our country safe

 I dont want to try and influence your vote at all orlee.I want you to vote for
whoever you feel will
a.Not lie.
b.Keep our country safe
c.Challenge the job loss to overseas markets.
d.Someone who you wont feel you have to make excuses for.

Now,as far as your statement
". first off. the
> republicans lied about the extent of this war to everyone."  totally untrue.In
fact,I seem to recall a speech Gw made at the start of this when he said "This
is not going to be easy,or quick.It will take a long time,and our will as a
country will be tested.And it wont be cheap.."  I dont see how you can
misconstrue this as somebody said it would be over quickly.Nobody ever said
that.
If you ment that george lied about weapons of mass destruction,again,this is
still not proven one way or another,at least in my world.I have seen interviews
with people who sweare they know that the weapons were moved to Siria,and where
they are to this day..I firmly believe this,and do not trust
iran,siria,pakistan,or anyone else on the henchmen of the worlds bribery list.Its all coming to a head over
there,trust me.We just havent declared ww3 yet,but that what it really is.I am
disapointed that you never checked into John McCain more before you go
vote.Maybe during the time before the real election you can check into his
qualifications further.Voting along party lines only will not ever end gridlock
in Washington D.C.In fact,I antisapate the Democratic party to be split by this
election,especially after obama wins the nomination,hillary steals it with
superdelegates,then obama runs as a independent,and the real democrats like
yourself will be wondering how the far left screwed up
your party.The young people are coming out in droves for obama,So maybe it is
time for a change..I hope obama can learn on the job training style,cause
hillary already knows how to steal our money from day 1.  John McCain cannot win
against the young popular vote simply because of the age difference.To be
honest,I'm fucking tired of the assholes my dads age running everything..they are the ones who fucked the world up in my humble
opinion.They did defeate the natzis and japanese over 50 years ago,but I have to
agree with the arab world on this,that they devided up the world after ww2
unfairly,and dominated the global markets,which,I guess,is part of the "to to
victors come the spoils".Which brings us to another question..How long can we
keep doing it?This is what is driving the jobs lost to overseas competition.We
still need fair trade,not protectionism.In my humble opinion..Now go
vote..lol..Mudd out.

More orlee

the vote for super tuesday is tomorrow.. boy every other commercial on t v is vote for hillary and obama.. i am torn by this vote for sure.. i want to mark my spot for hillary.. but i have to believe that she voted for the war from hell.. and that she was first lady when the jobs started to be sent from our country.. but i cant blame her for that one . or the war actually .. first off. the republicans lied about the extent of this war to everyone.. second.. it was a time when everyone was confused except george bush on what he was doing.. and third.. she must of had our country in the forfront of her mind to make the decision like alot of others who was lied to to vote in favor of it.lol plus she should of called me we would of done coffee and i would of changed her mind about fighting.. . myself i would of abstained from voting at all.. secondly the job losses.. it was not her real choice .. i would of hoped that she didn't actually have any part of that .. but bill did and i am sure as we all know.. in anything that comes before the president.. there is hidden adgendas and things added that are worded so no one understands it and makes huge loop holes .. so i guess i can excuse her for that too..

now obama.. here is a very very smart man.. who pertains to want to change our country for the best.. he wants to give tax breaks to companies who will stay here and make jobs here.. which is as it should be.. he says he wil help fix our health care system.. but they all say that one..
and that he will be a president for the middle class. whats left of us..
but that tiny little nudging in my brain says.. look if its too good to be true its probably something to be leary of..

so i guess i will be standing in a cloth booth tomorrow with the same questions in my head and hope for the best.. i do know this we cant take another 4 years of the republican reign.. sorry to those who may disagree with me..

i guess this is a disclaimer.. anything in this email is of my own oppionion.. not to be fought over and not to be lol a challenge from one side to the other.. lol.. so muddy if you have anything to say.. which might change my mind .. bring it on lol.. yea yea yea and huckabee.. but i dont get that choice on my ballot and i am not a switch hitter.. i stick with my democratic vote..

Only Part of the machine

Your only a part of the machine orlee.I get it from all sides here in washington
state.And I'm glad you checked into your partys way of fixing an
election..Republicans do not have this feature in their primary..This will
explain how it came about
There has been a lot of confusion over delegates and super-delegates. And,
because of the close race between Obama and Clinton, understanding the role of
delegates and super-delegates is going to be more important than in past
elections. However, understanding may be the easy part...Getting over the
seemingly less than democratic process, may prove to be more difficult.
So, lets take a look at the super-delegates...
The Super-delegates are party leaders and lawmakers, including all
Democratic members of Congress and former presidents Jimmy Carter and Bill
Clinton, as well as ex-vice president Al Gore.
If no candidate has a lock on the 2,025 delegates needed to secure the
nomination before the party's convention in August, the 796 "super-delegates" would be decisive.
Unlike "pledged" delegates chosen through primaries and caucuses,
super-delegates are free to vote for whomever they chose. Many have already
promised to back one candidate or another, "and most of the others will at some
point before the convention," said Michael Tanner, a political analyst with the
Cato Institute.
Who are the super delegates? The following information is from the 2008
Democratic Convention Watch.
List of super delegates that have already endorsed a candidate.
List of super delegates that have NOT yet endorsed a candidate.
Why did the party adopt the 'super delegate' system?
Super-delegates were supposed to supply some Establishment stability to the
nominating process.
Before 1972, party elders, such as Chicago Mayor Richard Daley and Charlie
Buckley, the boss of The Bronx who helped John Kennedy clinch the 1960
nomination, wielded inordinate power.
But in early 1970's, the party's rules were reformed to open the process to grass-roots activists, women, and ethnic minorities.
Sen. George McGovern, the leading anti-Vietnam war liberal, won the 1972
nomination. McGovern turned out to be a disaster as a presidential candidate,
winning only one state and the District of Columbia.
So without reverting to the days of party bosses like Buckley, the Democrats
decided to guarantee that elected officials would have a bigger voice in the
nomination.
Most people don't like the idea of our next presidential nominee being decided
by super delegates. And, if it comes down to that, I think there is going to be
some real trouble in the Democratic party. Personally, as a disenfranchised
voter in Florida, I would be furious if super delegates decided the nominee, but
Florida delegates did even get counted.
So now we all know how superdelegates came into being,and why.

From: ARLENE R BUTCHER
>
> lol am i a democrat smear machine.. lol.. look you dont need to stand alone..
> you can sit down and take the stuff i smear its ok.. cause i have a long list
of
> things to smear lol.. god love your grandma for putting up with so many
> republicans and comeing out of it ok..
> i bet everynight the darling woman went to sleep and prayed you all would get
> smart.. lol. wheres your sister now.. did she ever date sammy? cause he wasn't
> so bad.. he had a good job at least..
>
> hey muddy clue here... if pete lived and was a citizen here.. he would be
a
> democrat.. havent ya noticed he is leaning toward my side in it all and he
never
> liked bush either.. but thats over.. with .. we only have a few months and
> numerous days till the big day when that moving van is heading for the white
> house.. and a big change will be taking place.. new blood new.. workers .. new
> menus on the white house dinner schedule. heck isn't it the first lady or
first
> man who chooses what we all eat .. when i go to dinner there lol..
>
> oh by the way i do disagree with the superdelegates.. hell i would like to
> become one though .. imagine the perks to really getting the good stuff from
> both sides to choose right.. so ok tell me this.. does the republicans have
> superdelegates or is that limited to the ones who actualy go out and find
votes
> or does mccain have a few superdelegates up his ass (i mean sleeve)...?
>
>
> back to ya mudd

celebrity Death Match

I think the country is well aware of Ohios plight with that debate and your
emails.Ohio is not alone I'm afraid.I saw it coming with raising intrest rates
at the same time oil went to 80 bucks a barrel.
Now as far as being an undercover newscaster,funny you should mention
that..My longtime roomate jimmy is a democratic lead guitar player,and I play
the republican bass player/piano faker sometimes we make up songs to the news
shows (such as the ever popular 'pump an Iraqi) and end up making ourselves
laugh so hard we cant play anymore.All songs are politically incorrect,which
adds to their charm.I've been trying to get him to get with the program and
start makin ourselves a name on utube or cable radio as the Mudd and Jimmy
show,just for a laugh.But he would rather seek out homeless musicans and play
with them.Maybe someday he will go for it with me.Preferably during an election
cycle,as we seem to grind off each other well with our opposing views.By the
way,he's a Dennis Kucinich fan,which I am constantly teasing him about.I have a letter from George Bush hanging next to Jimmys door
with a picture of the white house I taped on it to make it look more
presidential.He still hasnt
commented on it,but he did like the 2008 calender I gave him for christmas of
george and Laura Bush closeups.
And as far as my ability to pick out the bad parts of any political
speech,thank my dad for this trait,as he was instrumental in grooming this
ability.
As far as why dont I like supporting the poor,we already do,I just have a
problem when I go work on section 8 housing projects and every one of them low
income people drive better cars than me and mine
do..Mercedes,bmw's,jags..etc..Because we pay their other bills,they get to buy
luxury vehicles.All I ask is somebody checks where the money goes someday.Which
wont happen cause thats more expensive than just giving it away,cause then you
got 2 groups stealing the money.The checkers and the checkees.
And lastly but not least,why dont I look for the good in the candidates?I'm still looking..The last I checked,the last 2 republican candidates have
run a totally muddslinging free campaign ,which I applaud.They even like and
admire each other,which I find a little discomforting,but not as scary as Mc
cains wifes eyes..Have you seen those light gray firey eyes?Pretty scary if you
ask me..I'm hoping it was the camera angle and glare..otherwize she might be the
antichrist..Mike,sue,hes your Senator,is she a good women,or a drill sargent
just waiting behind closed doors with a whip?Her "I'm proud of my America"
comment seemed like a challange to obamas wife..Is celebrity death match still
playing?Thats the fight I wanna see,maybe in the octagon on ultimate fighting.

Your hired

By orlee:
ok your hired.. to be the next undercover news caster for election day.. lol.. actually i am glad you watched that.. myself i am sure you want a oppionion right lol... it was not a good debate.. nothing we all havn't heard before.. its the same stuff different day.. there was nothing new brought up except that they both want ohio votes.. we do know now that the whole country knows were in trouble in ohio with job losses and no end in sight for our smart young children to have a fighting chance to make a living here.. but besides that i think your good at picking out all the bad parts of any democrat conversation.. can ya just look at the good this might bring.. so what you think were going to have to pay for the poor.. why is that such a issue with you.. because you yourself pertain to be charitable.. any money spent on the poor goes right back into the economy.. its a win win situation for most of us. even in the position of your job.. and i know you wont say so but.. if by chance a grant come through from the governemt in your area alone to find and fix up housing for the people who need help.. you would benefit with job opportunities.. its not always about just food.. there is durable goods every family wether needy or rich might have.. the one thing though that i caught upon was the fact that both candidate hit on that the administration and i wont say you know who.. is a president for the weathy.. he has written tax cuts to help them.. how does that filter down to us.. ? dont take that as a question.. lol.. just that those of you who are middle class.. not many of us left.. were now the pre-poor.. why cant you see that .. that the rich have had the benefits you and i might never have with a hand in the pockets of the politicians and vice vera .. so when you say .. the democrats will do this and that on a negative thought.. why not look for the good these candidates will do.. not the negative..

Im glad

I'm glad you are getting something out of orlee and my debates Pete.Thats
exzactly why I am writing all of these emails..To get others involved and so
people outside the usa learn a bit more of our system,which certinly isnt
perfict,and needs refining with our help.The system was set up before the
current media blitz,and has fallen into manipulators hands.It can be fixed
though.I do get kinda tired of standing alone against the democratic smear
machine..To be honest my dad started teasing his step-mother when I was growing
up about being a democrat,and they went round and round every election cycle.So
thank you to orlee for reminding me of those good times with dad and
grandma..and allowing the debates to continue.Ok,so they wernt such good times
with mom telling dad to change the subject and the tv!Then my sister would start
in teasing grandma that she would like to date sammy davis jr. and grandmas
mouth would drop open and then she would just shut up and grumble..Yes,this is
the
same one who hated reagon.So during the 80's it was real testy..And I learned to hold my own against the
democrats.

From: Peter Wakeling > I learn more from reading your emails muddy than i do watching Fox news... ill
> say that much..

My take on the dems debate

ok..heres my take from the debate..
Heathcare...obama wins..hillary would mandate we all buy insurance we cant
afford.
2.Hillary lies about nafta..she was all for it when bill clinton signed it into
law.now she claims she never liked it and it needs fixed//unfortunatly it cant
be fixed.They both are lieing on this issue..
3.jobs for ohio..Obama wants to invest,invest,invest..sounds like more spending
a comin..Clinton says shes gonna invest,invest,invest..sounds like more trash
talk.Both want to spend more of your money.
4.Clinton claims she went to china and stood up for human rights..I still see no
change in china so whatever she did didnt work..
5.Clinton claims obama wants to bomb pakistan..Clinton doesnt think this is
right..To be honest,we already are killing al quida member inside pakistan with
Predator remote control airplanes.
6.Iraq..Obama says we need to get out now no matter what.Clinton says we need to
leave,but keep a presence in the area but have an orderly withdrawl,beginning in
60 days,removing 1-2 bragades per month.
7.Afghanistan..Obama wants more troops in afghanstan.Clinton wouldnt shut up as
they went to commerical.Looks desperate.
8.they ran the wrong film clip..msnbc looks as hapless as usual.
9.More help for poor people.Hang onto your wallets again..more govt handouts
comin if eather of these people get in.
10.Obama says hillary cant claim her husbands experience as hers..I agree.she
cant pick and choose the good stuff she was for..the bad stuff she was
against..typical polititions positions.
11.Keeping their word.obama apparntly is flip flopping on public financing
money.All of em do this..no mystery here.
12.Clintons tax returns. they wont release it .sounds fishy to me..she claims
she will release the returns..I doubt it.maybe after the election she wont have
it ready before the primary unfortunatly.
13.lous farakaam.. obama denys any affiliation with this black man.will not
denounce his support though.tim ruppert is trying to get obama to say he will
support isreal..obama says he wont tolerate anti-semitisim.Clinton slaps obama with not denouncing
farakaan.
14.obamas voting record is more liberal than ted kennedys.National Review rated
obama this.
15.putins successor . Clinton claims putin is installing his successor.shes
probably right. Both will kiss his ass if they get in office..
16.Clinton gives concession speech..At least thats what it sounds like..History
making campaign..bla bla bla..Now the attack dogs are talking about hillary..her
attack dogs have turned on her,trying to make her look bad.god I hate msnbc news
people.
ok how'd I do?

I will watch it

I will watch it..what channel is it on?And you should go hear John Mc cain
speak.Hes somewhere in a burger stand near you kissing babies.I'm glad I finally
got an answer out of you..You sheep make it hard to get a straight answer,I mean
you democrats..See,when I hear you say it doesnt matter who gets in as long as
they are democrats,that worries me.Says "follow the heard no matter who lies to
who" to me.Maybe I'm wrong..I hope to hell I am..And about that florida
thing..wasnt that 2000 election stuff?Hell gore is even over it..Now that he has
his nobel peace prize he has quit whinin so much..Now heres the truth about that
election..Bush stole it..yup..he did cheat better than Clinton that time.His
daddy learned those "go after the the big states delegates only' trick the hard
way.And Carl Rove refined it.Here's more "truths" as I see em..Your party is
still upset with the egg on its face from the clinton lieing to congress about
monica lewinski.Spent the last 8 years trying to pass
that along to gw bush with the "bush lied" sticker campain and everything.Maybe it worked,maybe it
didnt..All I know it gave me a target to aim for up here with my
bumper..lol...Now I gotta get the "vote for monica lewinskis ex boyfriends
wife" bumper sticker..Hell I might even vote for obama.

Tonights debate

by orlee:
> i dont doubt your right you keep up on things.. it wont matter who gets the
> nomination of my party. they are both qualified to be president.. as far as
some
> men doing the picking thats ok by me to.. i didnt set up the rules. but they
> must of thought them out in great detail.. lol.. your forgeting your party
> declared victory before the total votes were even counted and how about
florida
> with is messed up system which put georgie in office.. before ohio was even
> counted.. its like you said .. we should have a super anyday where we all vote
> at once.. to pick our candidates..
>
> then all this stuff wouldnt happen to get everyone all worked up..
>
> by the way watch our debate tonight on t v.. it comes from cleveland ohio at
the
> cleveland state campus.. it should be very interesting and since your so open
> minded about this election lol.. you should want to hear my sides debate.. lol
> we will have a quiz on it tomorrow .

superdelegates

ok,I guess you just dont understand the question..But first lets not compare
FLYING AND GAMBLING COSTS to the price of a ticket to a football game..They are
not 1000 dollars unless you buy them from a scalper on ebay or somewhere
else.The price of a ticket is still under 100 bucks,except a playoff game..So I
still dispute your vacation theory..That said,for the fourth time,How do you
feel when obama gets more delegates,has more of the popular vote,and yet still
might not get the partys nod for their candidate because of an old rule put in
place by fast talking men in back rooms?This rule could let these old croonies
decide who the candidate will be regardless of the voters.As if they know better
who should get the nomination.This act could be considered treason in my mind.If
I was a democrat I wouldnt put up with this crap..This is all I'm asking.how do
you feel about this situation?Not who your voting for.
If you still have no idea what I'm talking about,I suggest you pay a little more
attention to the details of whats going on in your party.Do a search for SUPERDELEGATES and you
should be able to find some info on the rules for superdelegates.Thats what I
would like answered.Waiting for the next novel..Mudd out.

Unsure of the question

By orlee:
> i guess i am unsure of the questions.. if your asking me am i voting for
> hillary.. i am not going to sidestep it.. i will vote for hillary.. i always
> said i wouldnt vote for her ..i thought for the longest she is a caluclating
> bitch.. but if that is what it takes to make it in the world of political
humor
> and and honor.. to be elected as president to the united states . then i hope
> she a bigger bitch than i thought.. lol ..lets face it .. the presidental ring
> has new and strong players this time.. its a man oriented world .. my
candidates
> are both qualified.. both have law degrees and have put in their time to learn
> and do a great job if elected.. not saying that mc cain wont do a good job as
> president.. I was impressed with him before and thought he was a good man..
and
> still do.. i just fear he will stay on the same war path as bush and not
change
> much .for the middle class.. whom ever is elected will inherit the worst
> position and will be critized .. but guess what.. i wont be the one to do that
> lol.. i bet you find that funny.. i never actually critized a president till
lil
> georgie got into office. i have always been political but not to the point as
i
> am passionate as i am now.. there is a big stake in this election. and
hopefully
> were all on a win win situation..
>
> our country needs alot.. hell they should invite me to dinner with the next
> president.maybe you could come too... actually i might get kicked out of
dinner
> with bush .. you know protocal and all .. when i would stand up and say.. hey
> asshole what was you thinking.. lol i am sure those sunglassed guards would
boot
> me.. can you picture me at dinner with bush.. maybe i could go visit barbara
> bush and her cohorts.. lol wouldnt that be fun just a bunch of old ladies
> sitting back comparing notes on how well our children do.. imagine that
> conversation.. lol.. well ok lets not get carried away.. its a bad visual..
lol
> ..
>
> i asked once along time ago in a email..
>
> if you have one person you would want to sit down with and talk to one more
> time.. who would it be.?. if you could fill a table with people who are
> important to you to have a conversation with.. who would it be.?. i know my
> answer.. and guess what george bush wouldnt be at my table.
>
> whos at your tables..??
> its a tough question.. at my age.. i know the importance in my life. and i
know
> that all the bull shit that comes with life doesn't mean that much.. i will
tell
> you this .. the smartest man i ever met.. would be at the head of my table..
my
> dad.. now tell whos at your table..
>
> oh and by the way.. last year i checked on tickets to go see pittsburg steelers
> and clevelan browns.. they were upward of 1000 dollars for them.. if you could
> find some hacker to part with any.. to me thats a vacation.. i can fly to my
> sisters for 2 of us.. about 600 dollars.. i rent a car its about 30 to 40
> dollars a day.. i think most we ever paid with our coupon from the
entertainment
> book was like 250 dollars.. so now were up to 850 dollars.. food and gas for
the
> week well i will free load off them lol. not really wouldnt be that much for
me
> and willy. we might hit a casino hotel in reno driveing there.. and they will
> probably let us stay for free.alot comp. us for free food.. being gamblers
and
> all. when i gamble i normally allow 150 dollars a day.. now mind you that
doesnt
> count for my losses. i cant say i ever ran out .. ok i did a few times.. but
on
> a whole i am pretty lucky.i have taken vacations where the cost was out of
> pocket 2000 dollars .. maybe a little more.. but not much and had a hell of a
> good time.. and we stayed 10 days in california..
> so yes the cost of going to one football game could be a vacation for me..
>
> i am telling you i am the queen of cheap.. but i have to have alot of cheap
> thing..
>
>
> and by the way.. i saw on the news in california they now have marijauna
vending
> machines.. apparently you put in a perscription for pot and it dispenses it
like
> a bottle of soda.. aint this a wonderful world.. when you getting those in
> washington.. ??

You dont Piss me off

And you dont piss me off as much as you think..I just like facts being bantered
about,not bullshit.Again,now you've changed your story from going to a football
game will cost you a vacation for a family,(check below if brain needs
refreshed)to tickets for a season will cost a vacation and superbowl tickets are
18,000 (ha,good luck selling those,most go for 2-5,000 bucks.)I guess if this
makes your point,go ahead and change..I know this is a womans right..And I have
an offer for the seattle thunderbirds aa hockey team 10 tickets for 50
bucks.Thats not bad,and you get to hang out with funny canadians who have
nothing better to do on a saturday night than watch hockey. Nice job ignoring my
question again on the super delegates issue with obama and hillary..I really
want to know what you think..about hillary if she goes to super delegates to
secure the democratic nomination..Dont dodge it..dont fill the page with babble
that doesnt pertain to dick..Answer me please!

From: ARLENE R BUTCHER <
>
> checking on line for nfl superbowl tickets.. now mind you this is not your
> average football game as you know. its not unreasonable to pay up to 18
thousand
> dollars plus for 2 tickets..that i think includes your hotel stay within 10
> miles of the stadium.. now tell me again how cheap you can get tickets.. lets
> check regular games.. the baseball which is the cheapest for tickets in your
> area is from 35 to 120 dollars each ticket.. i am sure like here you can find
> discounted tickets. i cant really find regular season tickets for the football
> yet i think its too early for them to go on sale . i did see on ebay.. go
figure
> someone is selling half of their season tickets to the raiders. 2 tickets for
5
> games $999.00 thats 200 dollars a game. are you sure you can get tickets
really
> as cheap as you think? lol maybe your team is no good thats why tickets are so
> available and cheap.. lol.. utto actually i found a site has seattle seahawk
> season tickets for 1000 dollars each.. which includes sitting on the upper
> level.. and hey there is still some prices higher than that depending on where
> your going to sit.up to $2400 per season ticket.. so if 2 of you want to go..
> could cost a vacation amount.. if you want to take a family to a game i am
sure
> you will have pure sticker shock..
>
> here i can tell you willy and i go to atleast 3 or 4 baseball games downtown.
we
> have the akron aeros.. which is a AAA team the players go to the Indians or
> other professional teams.. its a great time and prices for us to go is under
10
> dollars a game each.. sometimes we end up with free tickets.. and the beer and
> food it cheaper too..
>
> but i am telling you i would maybe go to a football game but i cant see
sitting
> in the cold and paying a fortune for the tickets ..
>
>
> lol i figure i better change the color for this next stuff.. about the taxes.
> any speech george bush gave was to announce his tax breaks . not my idea. his..
> in his speech to the nation his he said and i am not just telling you this for
> the fun of it.. he wants to put inyo place a law so that anyone getting in
> office cant stop his tax cuts.he wants them permanent.. his rich buddies will
> love him for that. . ofcourse .we all know there so benfitting them poor
folk..
> lol thats a joke..
>
> as far as our money going to the poor for food.. you found the cheaters..
there
> is cheaters who take the money given to them and find a way to profit from
it..
> trust and believe there is truely poor out there who need that food and help..
> and i have no difficulty in taking care of the elderly and the poor.. your gf.
> son who bought that food card.. if its such a problem he should tell anyone
> trying to give him a deal on the card that you dont like when he does that and
> he has to stop.. any money that goes into the public from our government finds
> and filters its way back into the economy.. its a win win situation as far as i
> can tell..
> the best way to get people off aid from the government is through education..
if
> you give a man a fish he will eat for one day.. if you teach him to fish he
will
> eat forever..
>
> boy i would hope by the way.. cheney gets the boot too. so that will end his
> being the boss over anything...someone call rent a truck and make sure they
all
> have rides line up ..
>
> how much curiously is cigerettes in your state.? when we go to new york
> ciggerettes at the indian reservation are half of what the cost is here.. but
in
> ohio.there over 40 dollars a carton of 10 ... if you go outside your state and
> purchase anything cheaper.. on your tax form they want you to confess and pay
> them the tax dollars they missed out on.. i had a friend was ordering
cigeretts
> on line.. somehow he was told on by the seller or something. the first year
they
> called him on the tax.. was over 800 dollars.. they charged him 15 dollars a
> carton. in taxes..
>
> so now what.. do we complain about..
>
> you must see me as a whiner.. i see me as a strong american woman who is
> knowledgeable lol and it pisses ya off. i do know i am voting for obama or
> clinton.. your party can handle themselves. one of those losers will make it
to
> the ballot.. the next thing is learning who everyones running mate is..
>
> oh by the way.. here is a thought.. if you are getting ready to take a
airplane
> someplace and perchance the week or month before there was a plane wreck and
> some part was overlooked.. that caused the wreck. every plane now that you
might
> board will be looked at piece by piece. to make it safe as the day it was
made.
> right.. so here is the deal.. if per chance hillary should be voted in.. as
> madame president. guess what.. she is the first.. she will be put on a stool
for
> all the world to see. she will want to set the standards high for us. she will
> make sure in her history readings she was known for something other than filling
> a void for the seat. she is going to be strong and willing to take on a job
that
> maybe just maybe will be wrote about in the history books as one hell of a
great
> president. .. on that note i am hopefull. but either way both my candidates
will
> be first.. both are strong both have things they want to do to make our
country
> better. back to mc cain.. what did he say he would do for us? geesh i cant
think
> of a thing..

Enduring Questions

ok..lets answer those enduring questions for you this morning..First question:
1.What the hell has mc cain promised he will do if elected?I think he has
promised to be president.Other than that,do you really expect these guys to
accomplish any of what they promise in the run for president??The truth is,none
of what they promise will be acted on..If you vote because of what they
promise,I doubt if you will get what you want.And as far as following in the
footsteps of his now boss...Who do you think his now boss is?He is a senator
from Arizona,so I guess his boss would be the people of Arizona.and when He's in
Washington,I guess you could consider Dick Cheiny his boss as he is the head of
the senate.George is not his boss so quit trying to smear bush again.I am glad
you finally started to look at other candidates though.I cant wait till you pass
the democratic nonsense and start smearing the current candidates.Should be any
day now we should see it start from your party.I tried to get a debate going
about the crooks trying to steal obamas thunder from your part
y,but that was ignored,I assume because you want hillary to win,but I might be
wrong on that.I still await a discourse on that subject..I still have copys of
that email if you need a refresher.

Everyone struggles

muddy everyone struggles.. it doesnt matter how much money you have.. everyone wastes money.. from the very poor to the very rich.. if you gave a poor family .. i saw a show on t v.. a man who was homeless found a case.. was placed for a very poor person to find.. it had 100 grand inside.. a man pushing a shopping cart found it.. he first bought a car for a man who was in charge of where he would sell cans he collected each day.. he then bought himself a truck and flew to where his family was .. only to find when the money ran low so did the family love.. he didnt invest any .. was very generous with all his other homeless friends.he got married.. but lost that too when she found out there was no money.. . buying a bike for one and giveing money for food and alchol for most.. in the end.. he didnt plan the money he owned a new truck with no money for gas.. all his family had turned away again .. and he was homeless once more..
we all make our own destiny.. each one of us.. but there is forces which will not make it easy.. but then again .. struggle is good lf you remember where you came from and where your going .in the end .. we all get old.. we all lose our great looks and end up old .. but hopefully the dance was great..life can be good if you let it.. .. we all have those sad stories about someone near us who had a bad end.. hell i can tell you alot of those.. but to dwell is not a good idea.. i try to only remember the great times.. and guess what.. i took care of my parents and my brothers in their times of being sick and dieing.. and it was the hardest time of my life to lose them all. but i wouldnt of gave up any of the time.. i had to spend to take care of them..

Uncle Johnny

Hold on while I finish my bongload..phhhhtttt..ahhhhhh..I'm glad you took that
email in the spirit it was written orlee..I'll only clear up 2 mistakes in your
last response..It was my grandma who was a democrat that hated reagon till the
day she died..Not my mom..My mom worked for General tire also when it was called
aerojet general out in southern calif.She is still alive and does not recieve a
pension..my dad doesnt eather..He was able to earn,save,and invest..And he even
helped my moms youngest brother with some money each month for meds he needed
till last week when he shot himself in the head and left a note saying he
couldnt even afford to wash his clothes anymore.My mom and dad found him when
they went by to see why he wasnt answering their letters anymore.So when someone
suggests that I dont know how fucking hard it is to be able to retire,or that I
am way over the line by suggesting we all help each other ,trust me,I know! .And
my sister called me crying that she felt guil
ty of not doing more to help Uncle Johnnie..I said well,maybe you should look at these feelings.You
see,she could have moved him onto their property and things would have been
easier for him,but more difficult for her.She instead choose to move my parents
way out there so it would be easier for her to take care of them in her and
their retirement.
O,and you are right about the stealing of the social security money orlee..I
know of 3 times in my life congress borrowed the "extra" money in the kitty to
pay russias wheat bill.  Thats a fact..they did it while reagon was in office
also..and clinton.and bush 1 But now the russians are are friends,right?them and
China..And pigs fly!

I must Piss you off

@msn.com>
>
> ...lol hold on while i munch on a steak... so you have employees.. thats great
> you need them .. i didnt know you owned a company.. and you have set up
pensions
> and payrolls and all the things that go along with being employed.. do you
have
> workers comp and full benefits.. i know its difficult to set some of these
> things up but i am just curious.. how about unemployment? you must be doing
> well.. and oh by the way.. hold on munching on a potato and some salad lol..
> whats with me not sharing my pension.. why would i do that.. ofcouse i have
> money in the bank .. we were forunate enough to work for union labor.. which
set
> into motion the benefits we have.. hell i have benefited from my father being
a
> union man to moving on to willy whos father who was union and most of my
> brothers were union workers.. the wealth of most union workers is well known..
> my mother in law worked till she retired from goodyear.. they are still
> battleing for benefits for thier retired workers .. and themselves.. so yes we
> planned well or my husband employer did.. he went by all the rules in the
> process.. i bet your wages are based on what a union worker would get ..
> 
>     lol i must really piss you off lol...
> 
> oh by the way nixon was the first i think to dip into the social security fund
> to borrow or take some of the excess to fund god knows what.. we were at war
at
> the time.. and i bet if you look into it you will find as with most of the
> presidents after that, took from the fund on a regular basis.. where do you
> think george got the money for war.. wasnt from his back pocket.. ronald regan
> was a democrat till he turned republican to run for president.. which was a
big
> controversy back then.. alot thought he was still partial to the democrats
under
> his own party.. which is ok by me..
> 
> do you know how much of a social security check your mom got before they cut
her
> by 30 dollars you mention that she was bothered by that.. you need to remember
> that most older americans who got those benefits .most didnt have pensions
> either.. . your mom including used that money to live on.. they didnt do the
> things like we did.. with cable tv. vidio games.. going out to eat on a
regular
> basis.. going to the store was a big event and it wasnt a supermarket it was a
> store. most road buses.. cars were a luxury too.if they actually owned a car
it
> was one shared by 2 or more in the family. so if you think they lived a
> extravagant life style share it with us..
> my father went for the cheese the government gave out.. he stood in the line
and
> took cheese , butter and i think they gave rice and some other things here..
and
> yes he didnt need it but he lived during the depression and if the government
> gave it he excepted it.. so there was always a block of cheese in the fridge..
> along with planting a garden and haveing more vegetables to give an store away
> ..
> 
> did i mention that when i turn 62 i also will get a check from the government..
> my account is not worthy of alot but willy's is and i will recieve half of
> whatever he might get from our government.. some in my circle of friends think
i
> do not deserve a check since i was a stay at home mom.. and worked only from
my
> house and didn't pay into the system as their wives did.. i say oh well .. if
i
> marred another man or was married 6 times i could choose which husband makes
the
> most off of the system and then get my half check from that.. i am looking
> forward to my check.. for sure..
> 
> as far as me giving to charities.. i perfer to keep my contributions private..
> if i give its my business and i would guess the amount you give is private
too..
> working for mcdonald is not a bad job if you can stand it.. they do have some
> benefits from what i understand..  but i can tell you this i tell my children
..
> no matter what job you do .. do it with pride wether is garbage man or
president
> make your effort the best you can.. not everyone gets the cushy jobs in life..
> and make sure your educated enough to make sure you can walk and talk with the
> best ...
> 
> my family has had every kind of worker from minister to professors and a head
of
> a university , to fisherman and boat builders.. my brother was a artist and my
> father was a rubber worker.. who ran for a office in ohio till i was a teen
and
> won everytime.. my grandfather was a gambler on my dads side and was murdered
> when he won a big poker game.. as the story was told to me.. my other
> grandfather was a shrimp boat fisherman and then built boats for a living.. my
> cousin on my fathers side is a therapist and writes books and lectures all
over
> the world. her daughter works for the new york times.. i could go on but my
> family is as diverse as any you will ever meet..
> 
> i think you also mentioned my gambling.. geesh i am trying to spread all these
> subject out.. its like this.. we all have our vices.. you do a lil bong on the
> side i am unsure the cost of that and with drinking.. myself.. i have never
done
> drugs , i dont fault you for doing them, and i dont judge you for it..  but i
> would guess its as expensive or more so that the amount i use for my
> entertainment.. a addiction is just that something that you think will make
you
> feel better .. only to find out that in the end .. it was mostly a waste of
> time.i know you will tell me the drugs are medicinal to you.. both can be
> considered illegal . i have friends who dont gamble and they too make comments
> about it one in particular collects bicycles.. there called whizzer bikes.. he
> has probably 20 thousand dollars in 3 bicycles.. so wasting money is something
> everyone does..no matter what.. wether its smoking even cigeretts or
gambling..
> 
> me i am just a old fat grandma who works at home.. has a eye for makeing money
> sitting right here on ebay and enjoys my life.. i eat to much.. i watch t v.
to
> little and i piss you off big time i guess lol. we get our bills paid on time
> and help our children out when nessessary ..  god aint life grand...
> 
> i should put a disclaimer at the end of this..
> 
> this letter was formed from statements that i actually eat with this mouth
lol..
> why yes i do. in the process of writing this its ok he is mad at me for what
> happens here stays here .. and in the end hopefully after this lame election
> ..my party will win and it will be his turn to be upset with all the working
of
> the democratic office .. not to mention is pisses off most republicans on this
> list.. or maybe it will be better for our country we will have to wait and
see..
> anyhow in the process of this letter if it hit home a little to much and
pisses
> anyone else off. SOWWY.. 

We do sling mudd

by orlee :
yea he is right about one thing.. we do sling mudd .. pardon the pun pretty good.. as for my stickin my had down your pants lol .. if its anything like putting my hand in your pocket.. i didnt find anything there either.. just a pocket nothing else.. not even a bump..lol.. so to compare that note lol.. it aint happening.. if that was a form of appology all is forgiven.. truth is as truth does.. we all see things differently.. its like memories everyone has some .. if 2 share the same memory its going to be different and little details will be added and forgotten.. its the same with politics.. and cleaning your house..when someone comes to your house.. they don't notice what you do .. the notice what you dont do.. never mind you worked hard to fix things up.. but hey then i have a saying.. if you arent paying my bills you have no oppionion on my life other than the amount i let you have.. that and free advice is what you pay for it nothing.. so inlight of that.. we can all say lets get on with the election and my party winning...

7 Issues

Easy mikey..I did not get personal..If I'd wanted to,I could have..Even though
the smear job on republicans could be viewed as a personal attack also.Funny you
dont defend attacks both ways..Orlee and I can get pretty snappy at each other
without drawing blood.I still love her,and am sure she still would stick her
hand down my pants if she gets another chance.I even numbered my response's so
it would be clear Which false accusations towards the republican party I was
addressing.I still stand by every one of my answers towards that discussion.Nows
as to the pension stuff,I was replying to the accusation that every one of
orlees friends have no pension and now cannot rely on social security..Can we be
frank??You were never supposed to rely on social security..Even I knew this as a
teenager.And besides that,the democrates in congress say social security doesnt
need fixing..So when I suggested orlee and willy share their good fortune,it was
simply that..A suggestion..And I could have g
uessed both of your responses to that.You are both way too predictable.Cover the page with nonsense that
doesnt apply to what the discussion really is about.Like I need a lecture about
pensions..Not 1 word you wrote about pensions applys to what I wrote or was
refering to.

> So what gives you the right to judge Orlee's friends and their lack of
> pensions? You have NO CLUE as to the circumstances behind it. And then
> to suggest she throw some of her and Willie's pension funds over the fence
> to them .... that's out of line ... even for you.

Even for me huh? I guess I win the rerpublican asshole award for the month when
the truth is plain as day.As usual,shit thrown the republican way is ok,but
never type the stark cold truth,as you will be out of line..Same as your cnn
buddies..and msnbc buddies..and cbs croonies..and abc idiots..Add up everyone
who watches all those news channels and you will get about half the ratings of
my fox news channel,o so biased  as pete claimed..Its nice to get a bias the
right way sometimes..instead of the deck always being stacked to the left.So pick a number from 1-7 of
what I wrote and we can discuss real issues instead of making up tangents to get
upset about.In fact I dare you to discuss all 7 issues I wrote about..O thats
right,you all hate hearing the truth..I eagerly await the responses! Muddles
out.

Personal attack Tangent

gmail.com>
> "omg  did I get going off on a right wing tangent.."
>
> Yes mudd ... you did ... and a personal attack tangent at that.
>
> First, lets talk about pensions ..... in this day and age there are really
> no more pensions ... unless you are a government employee or schoolteacher.
> Most companies that HAD a pension plan either converted it into an
> optional 401K program or dropped it altogether, only giving pensions to
> those that were grandfathered in when the change was made.
>
> Several companies have gone under because the cost of medical/dental
> benefits and pension is too overwhelming.
>
> Now lets look at a couple of names you may recognize ..... Enron, Arthur
> Anderson, WorldCom, Tyco (just to name a few). What if Orlee's friends
> worked for one of those companies ? Do you think they PLANNED to not have a
> pension ? Do you think they planned to work for 10, 20, 30, or more years
> for a company only to have it collapse around them and give them shit in
> return ? IDFTS !
>
> Michigan, Ohio and Pennsylvania are three of the industrial centers in
> America hardest hit by unemployment, hundreds of companies have gone out of
> business, downsized, or outsourced and left behind a ton of enemployed
> people that suddenly lost retirements, pensions, or practically everything
> they worked for.
>
> So what gives you the right to judge Orlee's friends and their lack of
> pensions? You have NO CLUE as to the circumstances behind it. And then
> to suggest she throw some of her and Willie's pension funds over the fence
> to them .... that's out of line ... even for you.
>
> Bottom line is this ... we all work now and do our best to set ourselves up
> to retire and be comfortable. We have a lot of friends we love, but our
> family comes first and we are about as willing to give up part of our
> retirement funds as much as our friends are willing to share some of theirs
> with us. I just don't see it happening.

Do you eat with that mouth?

I'm not letting you get away with more crap out of your democratic mouth.Let me
make it perficly clear..
1.I work my own jobs,not any on the side..never sold 1 item on ebay.
2.The votes you are whining about in florida were sanctioned by the democratic
party for their own violations
this is out of the new york times :
Democrats in Florida and Michigan are increasingly concerned that their
primaries, held in January, will not factor into the nomination fight between
Senators Hillary Rodham Clinton and Barack Obama. The Democratic National
Committee stripped delegates from both states after they violated party rules by
moving up their primary dates.
So you cant blame george or his brother for that here anymore!
4.Republicans have alot fooled when it comes to money????? More bullshit.
democrates love to give money away..as long as its not theirs..
5.dont trust you will see alot of republicans own companies that they will make
it fair for the little
> guy that you should be a republican.. they like your vote they dont share their
> money.  Another swipe at republicans as a whole..And I take offence at that
statement.I bet I give more money than you do to charity and people in need
around the globe.And I take better care of people that work for me than the
union does.Just ask em.And to be honest,I cant always afford it..But I do it
anyway.And skip a lunch or two..As a fat american,that I can afford to skip.
6.most of my friends have no pensions.. now most cant rely on the social
> security..Well sir..I guess most of your friends should have planned a little
better,huh?Maybe you could share some of yours and willies retirement package
with them?I mean.since you have enough to gamble,and now some extra in the
bank.This seems only fair..Oh,and if they cant rely on social security
anymore,thank your democratic congress for not passing the bills they were asked
to when gw tried to save social security again and the congress said its fluid
till 2049 or something close to that year.Nice try,but you cant blame republicans for that eather.Tell your friends to get a job at burger king..My
girfriend did.
7.a chicken for every pot..Yeah I know a democrat said that..Thats why I said
some pot for every chicken
omg  did I get going off on a right wing tangent..I'm so sorry..Its just that
you remind me of my grandma who hated Ronald Reagon and claimed he cut her
social security check by 30 dollars a month.which was true,but the whole truth
of the matter was social security was bankrupt when ronnie took office..He
helped extend its benifits by cutting a little off each check..yes it was
smaller,but better than no check,which is what the other option was at that
time.And then my grandpa,grandma,and uncle went and got in line for the free
cheese loafs passed out by the govt at that time to poor people,which my
grandparents were not.

I aint blamin Georgie

From: ARLENE R BUTCHER <prncessorlee2@msn.com>
>
> first off let me congratulate you on working.. you must be working or selling
> doing a lil sales work on the side.. to pay for all the stuff you have now..
> thats great.. and hey lets get down to what i have to say now.. first off i
dont
> blame george bush for everything wrong .. i only blame him for the things he
and
> his family are doing.which made out country his own lil workshop for his own
> wealth. aint it sweet the election for him to be in office his brothers state
> screwed up.. and now we cant count the votes in florida for our primary..
hmmmm
> dont think that is not on every democrats mine? some place back in all our
minds
> is .. was that a strategy to not let the winner have the votes.. ( hey you
> brought it up) and if you really want the little guy to have some rights you
> better get on board with the democrats..
>     republicans have alot fooled when it comes to money.. dont trust that you
> see alot of republicans own companies that they will make it fair for the
little
> guy that you should be a republican.. they like your vote they dont share their
> money. and those internet companies who you think were the only winners when
the
> stock market was high .. guess again.. that portion of the stocks was high and
> in most instances they have continued to be a success story.. you have to
> remember .. everyone at that time wanted the best in internet.. we all wanted
> bigger faster computers.. fast internet speed..and every probram possible ..
> what do you have now.. i would suggest that you got everything you ever wanted
> for internet.. check out googles stock market price... google is suppose to be
> the best company to work for.. they even offer their employees free gormet
> lunches and free massages .. and all kinds of free perks to work there.. and
> most got to be millionairs with stock market perks of free stocks.. dam we all
> could use a job there..
>      most of my friends have no pensions.. now most cant rely on the social
> security.. how long must americans work before they can retire.. so if you
want
> a chicken in every pot.. by the way that was a democrat who said that for the
> chicken in every pot.. i believe it was either roosevelt or truman.. not
sure..
> but i know it wasnt a republican.. better check your history..
>       anyhow i am getting off the subject.. i guess my thought were going
left..
> lol.. muddy.. i am only a big mouth here.. and so are you lol.. there is alot
on
> this list who sit back and just watch the sparks fly.. we both know that. we
can
> debate who did what and why forever in my heart.. i do blame bush.. and come
> hell or high water.. we both know his war tactics and is bad judgements are
what
> made a mess of alot of things in this country.. he could of taken on things
that
> have hurt us.. like the jobs going oversea.. and they unemployment here. the
> values of our houseing market..and the loss of money jobs and a new age of
> poor.. the middle class is near gone and have become a new poor class.. in our
> state alone we are ranked 12th for the most bankrupt... so sure there is plenty
> of houses out there to buy.. its a buyers market only thing.. no one has any
> jobs or money to buy things with..
>  oh and by the way. the poor sucker who follows bush is in a mess not only has
> he messed up the budget.... from what he said in his last speech to the nation
> he is going to put into effect that the budget should be balanced by 2012..
what
> a legacy to fix for his ass..
>  
> 
> 
> on a lighter note i am going to buy me a new  flat screen t v.. this week.. i
> bet the mega million ticket.. here in ohio.. there is extra game at the bottom
6
> numbrs.. in a row.. depending on if you hit a certain amount like all 6 pays
you
> 100 grand.. i hit 4 of the 6 for a thousand dollars.. so this democrat ass is
> going for door 2 and getting a new t v.. 

The cream shall rise

Mike,we do agree after all..politics and religion should be kept seperate..And
just so you can understand my email better,I was simply stating to orlee that
all our ills are not georges fault.And again we agree.the system is broken..Now
the question should be...how can we fix it?One man (or woman) cannot fix all the
problems of our country,let alone the world.So I for one do not expect them to.
Its is up to us..each of us,and together we will do whats right.
Now I would like to debate the democrats elite trying to steal obamas
nomination..So floridas votes and Michigans were not supposed to count because
of activities that were not legal.Now we see the old party hacks trying to get
these delegates for hillary when they were not supposed to count..I say every
democrat trying this is a crook,and should be voted out of office as soon as
possible.Some are not even in office anymore (like geraldene ferraro)
This is not a coronation of mrs clinton simply because some on the left would
like to return to the "days of bill" because so many people got rich on the internet bubble.Trust me,all
was not rosey in the 90s despite what some would have us believe.I worked on
alot of those internet rich companys buildings,and I can tell you that alot of
money was wasted.Most are not even in business anymore,after spending so much
capital on fancy smancy door systems i've never even seen in rich peoples
buildings.Ok,back to politics..I hereby declare we start a new political
party..The left,right,and middle are taken..That leaves the top,and the
bottom..I suggest we start the bottom party,as we will work our way to the
top.Normally,I would start at the top,and work my way down,using gravity..But in
this case,the bottom means the little guys..us..The working (and retired) poor.I
hereby nominate all of you as superdelegates in the bottom party.Equal rights
will rein in the power sharing arrangement.An
d pot for every chicken..lol..I think I'm on to something here..I better
copyright the Bottom Party before some gay group protests..
And the cream shall rise to the top!

Cant wrap his head around

From: MnS <emmness@gmail.com>
> OK ... so I gotta give you props when props are due ... you got all the
> stuff you wanted to get
>  or did the stuff you wanted to do.
> But, unfortunately, I can't wrap my head around what that has to do with
> whoever is in office Bush (now) or Clinton (before Bush). No president has a
> direct influence over how you make your money, spend your money or use your
> time, and hopefully they never will.
> It would seem to me that you were determined to do whatever was necessary to
> get/do the things you wanted and you completely suceeded and this speaks a
> lot for you and your character. Especially after you were told to get ready
> for a wheelchair .... that's preserverance and I respect that !
>
> Bottom line is .... our political system is broken .... as each year the
> politicians seem to make subtle changes to the rules or laws that regulate
> how government operates. I still firmly believe that we need to keep
> religion AWAY from politics ..... it's like gas and matches .... you don't
> give them to children to play with ... especially TOGETHER.

we will differ from time to time

Everyone has their opinion,and we will differ from time to time,but Heres
another fact..I am a Buddhist,and do not feel mike huckabee has offended me or
wants to infringe on my constitutional rights..Maybe  the people in this country
who dont want any reference to god in anything could get over their
paranoia.Mike Huckabee is not in power,or has he promised to change the
constitution if he gets in..He merely pointed out its "easier to change the
constitution than the living word of the Bible"  This is a fact,but he isnt
promising to do this.What he does promise is that he is a believer in god..But
when asked in a cnn debate if he believes in evolution or creationism,he claimed
not to know,but continued to try and be tripped up by the asshole question asker
from cnn when asked if he believed god made the world in 7 days,he again replied
calmly  I wasnt there,so I dont know"But what he does promise is not to change
his beliefs for an opinion poll,or a political contest,or a vote for
or against him.What he is,is a believer,and he stands proud on that fact!And I applaud his character.I
feel you should be a little more worried about being forced to adopt the koran
to pacify the muslims..Fuck that.. Pay a little more attention to the shit
happening in the world instead of being blinded by american politics.Lets debate
the assholes rioting in denmark.,the full on war about to begin in palistiene
with isreal
This is all related to your Im afraid mike huckabee will force god  down our
throughts statement...Totally untrue,and unfair.The fact of the matter is WE ARE
AT WAR WITH THE FANATICS OF ISLAM and the quicker you realize this,the better
our response will be.These are the assholes trying to force their shit on the
world..come on,cartoons more dangerous than cutting peoples heads off with
swords???I am glad John McCain might be the leader against this fight.I know
what his response will be..I dont think O'bama or hillary knows what to do about
Pakistan.Maybe I'm wrong,maybe by leaving the fight in Iraq as obama wants we can
hide our heads in the sand again and they will go away and leave us
alone....Maybe..

regarding your candidate

From: MnS <emmness@gmail.com>
> Muddy,
>
> I have not said much regarding your obvious favorite canditate ... Huckabee,
> although you seem to be enamored by him for some reason or another.
> He was interesting for a while ...... until he went to michigan and said
> something that scared me .... and should really scare a lot of people. As
> everyone probably knows by now ... I firmly and truly am a believer in the
> separation of church and state. The two things that cause more wars and
> problems on this planet (politics and religion) should NEVER be allowed to
> work in concert with each other. This is really the main reason America is
> even here today.... religious persecution. Agreed ?
> So here is what he said in a speech in Michigan ....
>
> "But I believe it's a lot easier to change the Constitution than it would be
> to change the word of the living god. *And that's what we need to do -- to
> amend the Constitution so it's in God's standards* rather than try to change
> God's standards so it lines up with some contemporary view."
>
> Now THAT is scary .... Read the constitution .... it makes no mention of god
> .... it's about the PEOPLE ! And along comes someone like Huckabee ... that
> wants to change our constitution and inject religion into it.
>
> Where does that leave the aetheists ? Or people from other religions ?
> To me ... that seems like, once again, someone trying to cram their
> religious beliefs down my throat ... but now with the power of the
> presidency behind it trying to force it on EVERYONE !
>
> I'm sorry ..... but, I don't freakin' think so.

lets compare

ok,lets compare...on a personal note while bush has been in office..I have 
1.bought a home I thought I'd never be able to afford..
2.Bought a truck and car,paid both off in less than half the time alloted,
3. Paid cash for my dream 57 inch tv,also got the surround sound sony to add to
the system.
4.Started a business without much capitol or help from anyone,including the
govt.
5.bought almost every musical instrument I have ever wanted,including a studio
in my basement,9 keyboards off ebay,3 drum sets,2 bass guitars,3 electric
guitars,amplifiers,mics,cords,mixers,smoke show,light shows,1 desktop and 2
laptops to add to my system and network.
6.I bought a jet ski
 I'm not trying to brag,I just want you all to know that I did all of this
after being told I had 2 incureable deaseses and that I should get ready for a
wheelchair and not much of a life!So I have to disagree with my friends that
there is anything wrong with this administration and that it doesnt encourage
growth and success.and by the way,if you want the list of what I lost while Clinton was in office,just ask..That
list is way longer than the one i just did for bush.So I respectfully disagree
with your premise that the govt is to blame for your situation!YOU are in
control of YOU,and if I can do this,everyone else can too.Be positive,not
negative,and you will be far further in your life.Muddhaa out.